Exiles or Emigrants?

[Ned Kelly]

Emiigrant Aid An end to exile? I actually knew one of these guys who were given the option of going to england or going to gaol!


By Ultan Cowley

'It's not the money - it's the fact that people back home remembered'. These words, from a recent client of Cricklewood Homeless Concern quoted in the current issue of Cara in-flight magazine, speak volumes about the reality of the Irish emigrant experience in Britain.

http://www.emigrant.ie/images/indeximage.asp?id=3626 Ireland needs to acknowledge the lives of the Irish who laboured abroad, says Ultan Cowley. (Image from The Men Who Built Britain) For much of the last century the boot was on the other foot; our emigrants earned money by the sweat of their brows and sent it selflessly to those at home who badly needed it. 2.2 billion pounds in cheques and money orders alone came from the Irish in Britain just between 1939 and 1969. It wasn't for nothing that a railway porter in the Irish midlands used to call out, 'Connaughtmen, and Horned Cattle, to the far platform, please!' in the early 1900s.

The State's education budget in 1960 was £16 million. Emigrants' remittances that same year totalled £15.5 million! Yet 82% of emigrants to Britain in 1960 had left school by the age of fifteen.

Two hundred thousand Irishmen worked in British construction in the nineteen sixties. They were indispensable to post-war reconstruction. Sir William McAlpine told me personally that the contribution of Irish labour to his industry was 'immeasurable'. Britain's fledgling National Health Service was staffed mainly by Irish nurses and catering in schools, hotels, and hospitals depended heavily on Irish labour.

There has always been a tendency in Ireland to take pride in those who went to the United States, but to be somewhat ashamed of those who went to England. How many of us remember the practice, once common in the courts, of giving a young man in trouble the choice to 'Go to gaol, or go to England'.

The negative stereotype of the 'all-brawn, no-brain, drunken Irish navvy' is one too many Irish people here bought into. What they failed to appreciate was that, in construction as in other trades, the pub was the labour exchange - hence the proliferation of British pubs called 'The Mason's Arms', 'The Bricklayer's Arms', etc.

Of course, in that all-male macho industry, men were prone to bouts of drunkenness and fighting - but they also thronged the Irish churches on a Sunday morning, gave their labour free of charge to build clubs and centres for their fellow emigrants, and faithfully remitted hard earned money when they could have spent it to improve their lives or save for their old age. Few ever benefited directly from their own remittances.

Father Owen Sweeney, chaplain on the Spencer Steelworks project in South Wales between 1959 and 1964, said of the Irish navvies, 'I came to appreciate the inestimable value of their contribution to human well-being. I came to regard them as the true nobility of society ' humble, hard-working men, who rarely complained about their lot'.

John Cox, an Englishman and former chairman of major player Tarmac Construction, said to me in the firm's head office in Wolverhampton, 'I know many able Irishmen who could have been behind this desk, instead of me, had they had an education'.

Now the remnants of the half million Irish men and women who emigrated to Britain after World War Two are old and, in many instances, isolated, and alone. Alienated by history from British society, 'they taught us to hate England, and then they sent us over here', and forgotten or ignored by those at home.

Teresa Gallagher, Director of Irish Counselling and Psychotherapy, has said of them: 'We are finding deep wells of sadness in ordinary human lives'.

That sadness is not caused by emigration - you don't find it amongst the Irish in Australia or America, for example. These people feel themselves to be exiles, not emigrants, and their sadness stems from the justifiable conviction that they have been rejected and forgotten by their own people.

My book, The Men who built Britain, told the story of the Irish in British construction. I put their lives in context for the first time and, as often as possible, used their own words to describe their experience. Few of them could understand why anyone would want to do so and that was the measure of their humility. But many wrote touching letters later expressing their appreciation of the book. Here's how one man put it: 'You told it as it was. It brought back anger, sadness, and tears. It also brought back memories of pride, joy, and laughter; of men who earned their bread by the sweat of their brow. God rest those who are gone. PS. I prefer to remain anonymous.'

My aim now is to see these emigrants acknowledged in today's Ireland before it is too late. Assisted holidays, cultural exchanges, inter-generational reminiscence projects, personal correspondence, and communication via dedicated air and print space should all be happening on a daily basis. The culmination and symbol of this outreach should be a National Emigrants' Day, La na hImirce, when our emigrants are honoured and included, no matter where they live, and funds are raised to improve their welfare wherever necessary including resources for burial in Ireland where so desired.

I call this the End to Exile campaign. Exile in Irish is Deorai, meaning Placelessness and Banishment. A state of mind, as much as of being, it is corrosive and obscene but it is not imagined. Its time that we in Ireland ended it.

Ultan Cowley is an independent historian and author of "The Men Who Built Britain".Visit his website (http://www.geocities.com/ultancowley/).


Correction: An earlier version of this article misstated the amount of emigrants' remittances in 1960 as £25.5 million instead of £15.5 million.

http://www.emigrant.ie/images/righthead1.gif

[fullastern]

I suppose Ned that an exile was traditionally someone who was forcibly away from home while an emigrant went by choice. The lines between the two were often blurred because if your people are starving and impoverished and you go away to make a better life and send money home then you are exiled by circumstances. I remember when I was very young one of my neighbours in Cork used to go away every couple of years to England when work on the building line here became scarce. I remember one time my father drove him and his entire family down to Horgan's wharf in Cork to the B&I line terminal to the old Innisfallen - (the pre 1969 one) - it was a glorified cattle boat. His family stood on the quay in tears as he walked up the gang plank with his entire belongings in a small hand case (you couldn't even call it a suitcase) and his donkey jacket over his shoulder. That was around 1968 and I was six years of age but still remember it vividly. My own father went to Germany in 1972 with about 40 other Cork building workers. Unfortunately the company that sent them hadn't done their homework properly and the men were without work visas so they were all deported.

[Ned Kelly]

Exile and Emigrant are the same if those people left their homeland for want of employment and to support their families back home, neither had a choice!
It was for a purpose so i can't the difference.
I also looked out from the black railings *Lake Road* to see family and friends depart for a *better life*abroad.
I also made that trip to england in hope of a better life and I found one eventually but even though I met my wife in england(she is australian). It was not till i came here to Oz that my life started to become what I hoped for!
Mind you it took 20 years in this country to realise that fact.
I feel sad for the Irish diaspora in england, I worked in pubs there for years and I came across many lonely old Irish guys that had nothing but the pub, mostly alcoholics and a lot of them homeless also. I remember asking one old irish guy did he ever think of going back home, He looked at me and said why would I sure theres nothin there for me now!
I think a lot of Irish people in england feel the same way and who could blame them/ Nuff said? I don't think so!

[Ned Kelly]

I think somehow it links to this thread bigtime, i hope i'm wrong!
20 March 2008

Irish culture relegated to back of the parade

GALWAY’S St Patrick’s Day parade was very colourful and fair play to all who took part.


But I wondered where were the representatives of Galway’s Irish dancing schools or Conradh na Gaeilge and other noteworthy Irish cultural movements.

Have we now become so politically correct with the advent of multiculturalism we are afraid to portray all that is best in Irish culture?

Are we failing to fund Irish music and dance as we have in the past? The lack of funding for the feis ceoil and Comhaltas Ceoltoirí Éireann is shameful.
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We have the Department of Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs and Udarás na Gaeltachta to promote the Gaeltachtaí, but they don’t seem to see that being Irish is more than speaking a language — funding of traditional Irish culture should be part of their remit.

The millions spent on translating EU documents would be better spent supporting the feis ceoil which has given us so many great musicians over the years, including the great John McCormack and many of our talented present-day tenors.

James Joyce, our most famous writer, was also a tenor of some note and took part in the feis in 1904 when he came third, winning a bronze medal

Music and dance are part of our great tradition and we are renowned for both worldwide.

We should not be making excuses for being Irish in our own country under the guise of multiculturalism.

We have so much to be proud of in our own rich culture.

Nuala Nolan
Bowling Green
Galway

[Kieran]

I read that too this morning Ned and its a load of crap. There is no limit to how many floats are in any parade, including Cobh, Galway or Belfast. If the traditional Irish Floats are less inclined to enter or happen to be outnumbered so what? I could never fault any group from whatever part of the world trying to blend in and celebrate our national day. On the other hand, I could and do condemn our native young ass-holes who go around pissed, violent and bent on distruction as their contribution to our national holiday. They murdered a taxi driver in front of his wife and child in Dublin. They wrecked Finglas and parts of Cork. In Cobh the rooted up a big waste bin in front of Norwood school and rolled it down the hill with its contents all over the road ( i have the pictures). Nothing traditional about that!

[Ned Kelly]

Well i suppose we all can pick and choose what we read and quote on our perceived ideas and judgements. As usual K we are poles apart (no pun intended) on our perception. I was stating a point about Irish abroad and i thought that exam letter tied in to their feelings of isolation to the homeplace!
For a left winger K you seem to be leaning far to the right. We were all stupid buggers when we were younger and did a lot of silly things, Such is Life! As far as the murders are concerned, thats way beyond the Pale, But it seems that is the Ireland of today, drug culture is rampant everywhere and the innocent pay the price! I could go on but whats the point, I have no solutions!, Good luck!

[Kieran]

Drug culture is rampant Ned but I was not talking about that,. I was talking about the way young people relate getting pissed with our national holiday and outdoing what they did the year before. It has nothing whatsoever to do with being poor or deprived, infact it may well be the oppossitie, so spare me the left-wing/right overview. Yes Ned we all drank under age. I found myself in court for it when I was 14, so I know all about it. I like you and everyone around us, did our best even when drunk to conceal what we were doing. not trying to wreck everything around us or trying to kill people. I think the drugs and violence that go with them, is a seperate matter from the 'lets get sloshed its Paddy's Day' culture! Ps, About 3 days a week, I have to empty my front garden of empty beer cans and bottles from the local youths who drink on the other side of my wall, they lob them over after they finish, in the late or early hours of the morning, despite a wheely bin being only a few feet away. Would it be very right-wing of me Ned, to expect them to take their cans/bottles away with them or to even put them in my wheely bin?

[Ned Kelly]

Is Alcohol not a legal drug ?Far more lethal than some illegal drugs!
Just a Thought K If you know these buggers, gather up their cans and bottles and chuck them back in their backyards with a note saying if I find these dumped in my garden again next time you will get them back full of petrol!

[Kieran]

Are you trying to incite me Ned Kelly?

Na'h the feckers dont show up until I'm well asleep, well into the A.M. If I really took the bother, I would find out who they are, but as long as its only a bit of littering, I'll get over it. Its when they damage cars and root up threes and shrubs in other parts of the estate, that they need a bit of attention.

[Ned Kelly]

Mebbe a visit from the ol brigade would sort em out!

[Kieran]

As you said yourself Ned, we were no saints at their age. Once they know the boundaires and respect them, I'll let them be!

[Ned Kelly]

Naw we were never saints K, but now that we are the ol bastids, I ain't puttin up with it just like the ol bastids did'nt in our day And nor should you, gotta keep em honest. When I kicked a ball over the neighbours fence I got it back with a knife in it, Must admit when a ball comes over my fence I just kick it back, But if it was empty cans comin over I would/nt be too pleased , Thats disrespect mo chara! The least they could do is fling a few full ones over, the tight arsed gits! But then again I spose we are talkin Cork misers here!;)

[Kieran]

Not always, we were called to photograph the aftermath of a bush party held at Ramblers a few months back. There was as many full cans scattered across the pitch as empties. The little feckers eyes were bigger than their bellies!

[Ned Kelly]

Leavin full cans, Just goes to show the buggers are spoilt rotten, In our day in millwooods and the donkey plus joanies ya never left nothin behind!

[Kieran]

You can say that again!

[Ned Kelly]

Cept for Puke !!!

[Ned Kelly]

Bulmers cider by the flagon, never even thought about bush drinkin back then when ya could get all ya wanted or needed in the underage establishments which were a plenty, don't ask for credit, I've had yer money you've had yer piss now feckoff, was a sign in one local pub.How times have changed!:eek:

[Ned Kelly]

I think I actually got pissed on cidona one time when I was told it was cider, just goes to show the power of suggestion,lol!
I remember when I was in recruits in the navy we got one of our lads DF, (Cobh man) he'll remain nameless, pissed as a fart one night in the comm! we started him off on double vodkas and coke he had 2 and the rest of the night he had plain coke as we had a word in the barmans ear, he was 150 sheets to the wind by closing time we had to carry him from the comm on to the boat and when we got the base we had to carry him all the way up to the billet. He woke up with a huge hang over next morning. When we told him what had actually happened the night before, he would'nt have a bar of it.:D

[fullastern]

The country is safe in the Naval Service's hands so Ned, right?

You should enjoy this one so.....

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=II5tqdp-JUk

[Ned Kelly]

These days probably Fulla??? 34 years ago Who knows, we were professional even in those days believe it or not!I was a bit after the macha and the cliona, I served on the deirdre and for its day it was luxurious compared to what came before.

[fullastern]

I remember the Ferdia from the 1970s - it was a converted trawler. I'm sure the modern ships are very luxurious - and there's two bigger ones ordered. At the rate our neutrality is being sold down the river we'll probably have NATO in here shortly anyway.

[Ned Kelly]

BBC News Online http://news.bbc.co.uk/furniture/grey_pixel.gif http://news.bbc.co.uk/furniture/nothing.gif Amid the massive deployment of US troops to the Gulf, a civilian airport on one of Europe's western-most peninsulas has become the focus of one country's identity crisis.
Ireland's Shannon Airport is at the centre of a public row over its increased use as a stopover for military and civilian aircraft carrying US army personnel, most of them on their way to the Gulf region.
Shannon has traditionally served as a stopover for transatlantic civilian carriers.
For more than 50 years it has also allowed foreign militaries - largely the US - to use its facilities, under an agreement which up until now had been largely accepted or ignored by its citizens.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/38734000/jpg/_38734263_airport_150.jpg Opponents say Irish neutrality is being jeopardised

The arrangement has long provided a much-needed boost to the local economy in a country that has been a loyal diplomatic ally of the US.
But over the past weeks, accusations of arms being carried on flights through Shannon have served to heighten public anger.
Thousands of people have turned out at the airport to protest, demanding answers from the government and clarification over whether the state's long-held neutral stance has been sacrificed for economic gain.
The issue of neutrality has played heavily in Ireland's recent general elections and bouts of referendums.
Ireland has stood on the sidelines of all major conflicts since it affirmed its neutral stance in 1937 to stay out of World War II.
'Compromise'
But the acceptance of the Nice treaty effectively threw Ireland's weight behind a joint EU defence strategy, which anti-treaty campaigners say will compromise its neutrality.
As a non-permanent member of the UN Security Council, Ireland voted in favour of the resolution demanding Baghdad to allow weapons inspectors back into Iraq.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/38734000/jpg/_38734463_ustroops_150_2.jpg Foreign troops provide valuable benefits to the local economy


Now, with the growing prospect of US-led military action going ahead even without UN backing, it finds itself in a difficult position.
Prime Minister*Bertie Ahern's* government has repeatedly denied that the Americans' increased use of the airport has put security or neutrality at risk.
The truth is that it is a mutually beneficial arrangement which the Irish Government is loathe to forego.
Foreign Minister Brian Cowen insists that Ireland will provide its support, and territory, to military action authorised by a second UN resolution.
By way of reassurance, he also said that should military action go ahead without UN backing, Shannon's continued use by the US would have to be thrashed out in the Irish parliament.
The decision would have a huge bearing on the future of Ireland's status militarily - made all the more relevant by the ongoing debate over whether the country will join Nato.
It would also highlight the fact that a country that has remained silently "friendly" to the US can no longer sit on the fence, quietly benefiting from its arrangement with the superpower.
Neutrality Fulla??? We've always been a pawn to either the yanks or the poms!

[fullastern]

I agree Ned, but I believe in fighting that kind of collusion and standing up for our neutrality which is being sold out by our politicians, not the people.

[Katy]

Aaahh!! Cider....oohh!! Ned i like apples but Cider.....aahh!! no thanks:):)

[fullastern]

Aaahh!! Cider....oohh!! Ned i like apples but Cider.....aahh!! no thanks:):)

One glass of the stuff and you begin to develop a Devon accent with all the oooh arrs of same. Like the ads on tv for Ambrosia Rice.

[Ned Kelly]

Neutrality was a choice when ireland was poor and *backward* But now that ol Eire counts itself amongst the wealthy, it seems we no longer have that choice?

[Katy]

[quote= Like the ads on tv for Ambrosia Rice.[/quote]


AAhh!! now Fulla, you cant beat home made rice pudding......mmm!! some like it with jam or sugar on top.........some like it when its got a crispy top covering.......oohh!! aahh!! Katy must be making some rice pudding next week...........:)

[fullastern]

You can't beat rice pudding? That could be true Katy, my aunt used to make it and there used to be a thick skin on the top of it because she always overcooked it. You could beat it, but there was no guarantee you were going to break through!:D

[Kieran]

I disagree with both you Ned and Fulla. Ireland always has a choice no matter what the circumstances. The recent Lisbon charade proved that. As for the politicians selling out our neutrality, yes they are but we dont exactly see or hear the irish people rising up to protest or even voting those politicians out. Fulla, you will remember well when you, I and 8 or 9 more picketed a US war ship in Cobh last year. Thats all we could muster up at the time and many of those were from outside of Cobh. Unfortunately it will take a war and Irish people to arrive home in body bags before people realise what they had given up!

[Ned Kelly]

Just more of the same K, Apathy is rife when bellies are full!
Just look at Fullas and katys posts more talk about rice puddin!

[Kieran]

Bring on the soup kitchens and back to basics!

[fullastern]

I disagree with both you Ned and Fulla. Ireland always has a choice no matter what the circumstances. The recent Lisbon charade proved that. As for the politicians selling out our neutrality, yes they are but we dont exactly see or hear the irish people rising up to protest or even voting those politicians out. Fulla, you will remember well when you, I and 8 or 9 more picketed a US war ship in Cobh last year. Thats all we could muster up at the time and many of those were from outside of Cobh. Unfortunately it will take a war and Irish people to arrive home in body bags before people realise what they had given up!

Where did I say we hadn't a choice? Yes and I would picket again if they came tomorrow - as I have done in Shannon many times. And there were more than eight or nine - I counted around 35 one evening and half of them were from Cobh.

[Ned Kelly]

29 irish soldiers have been body bagged out of lebanon since '78. and thats just lebanon!

[Kieran]

That was in reference to Neds comment Fulla. A few of those 29 were killed by their own Ned, one soldier from Belfast opened up on his own some years ago in the Lebanon. He cracked they say, but I suspect there was much that we didnt hear about there. I recall in the 70's a private from Midleton cocked his rifle while on duty in Monaghan and was about to fire on some of his platoon members because they took the piss out of him. They call it bullying now, foolish when the person being bullied has a rifle in his hands.

[Ned Kelly]

Bullying was and still is a part of life in the armed forces worldwide.
When I was in recruits in the navy I got stabbed in the hand by a jackeen because I refused to polish his boots, i smacked him across the gob with said boots and never had any problems after that!

[Ned Kelly]

Shite I love readin these ol threads, They make me smile!

[Kieran]

Is the jackeen someone we know Ned?

[Ned Kelly]

Possible K, But I can't remember his name now, I can see his mug but can't put a name to it!